Pond Boss Forums MANAGING AN EXISTING POND Corrective stocking Big problem in my Perch Pond!!!! Need advise

So I have a 3/4 acre pond that I stocked for trophy yellow perch with the help of Bill Cody several years back, I have succeeded with my trophy perch biggest one to date was 17 inches with several 14 to 15 inchers, I also have Walleye,hybrid stripped bass and had Male bluegill only, I was pellet feeding and stocking 40 lbs of shinners and fathead miinows 2 times a year, I also added some red ear sunfish and pumpkin seeds which have never been a problem, But early last year I noticed I all of a sudden have green sunfish in my pond they had to have been mixed in with the minnow dumps, and now to find out this year I have thousands of bluegill 2 inches long, I have been trapping them to get them out, but I don't think that's going to do the trick.

So My question is what do I add to keep my bluegills and green sunfish populations in check? I rteally don't want largemouth bass in the pond.

Do I add catfish? More Hybrid Stripers? or smallmouth bass? I am located in North East Indiana.

Thanks

Jason

I would Like to keep my trophy size yellow perch as well..

Following along. I’d like to see solutions to this. At least you didn’t do it to yourself on purpose. I actually stocked HBG. I was told they wouldn’t reproduce.
I have been removing them ever since. I was also told they wouldn’t bother swimmers. Agh!!

17" YP? Congrats buddy - that is amazing!

I have had the same issue in my trophy male lepomis pond - somehow a female got by me and had reproduction...3 times now. This pond is about .3 acres, and every time I have drained, seined, nuked, and restocked with original fish I hold in a spare cell or cage in main pond. I realize your pond is over 2x the size, but is draining and seining a possibility? You'd need a cell to hold your fish during the 2-3 week process, and you'd need supplemental irrigation to refill the original pond quickly. If you want to do this, I'd wait until Fall, and definitely call me I can help you through the steps.

I realize it's too late for this advice, but I recommend hand sorting anything stocked into the pond - shiners, fatheads, shrimp, etc. Just too easy for a hitchhiker to impact your fishery goals.

If solution 1 is not an option for you, managing your BG population will now be a management priority. I would not stock additional predators and impact your nice balance going right now - rather manage BG populations by seining, angling, trapping, and cast netting. I do this on my main pond which features a very similar fishery as yours but I have the same BG management issue. I've reached a stage where I'm growing some BG to 11" but through heavy pressure am addressing the tendency to overpopulate and stunt. For now, I'm on top of it...but it requires a lot of work to cull 3-6" BG throughout the year. Kinda a chore.

If you cannot apply the management pressure necessary to manage the BG population, MALE LMB would be an option. Males will only grow to 2# so you have a limit to their max potential gape, which prevents your trophy YP from becoming meals. I'd start with 3-4 male LMB, sample your BG population periodically through seining, and see if they're successful. If not, you could supplementally stock another 1 or 2 and repeat the process until you're seeing the results you desire.

Introducing SMB is an option, but their limited gape does impact their effectiveness on managing BG over 3-4" in my personal experience....that's why I suggest the male LMB.

I list these solutions in order of personal preference just FYI.

Ping me anytime I am happy to help - unfortunately I am all too familiar with this management issue.

Who told you HBG don't reproduce? You know better!

Your HBG recruitment shouldn't be very high, unless you don't have true F1 HBG and they are far more fecund than pure F1 HBG. Are they stunting? Why are they serving as a management issue? Should be a nice bonus catch attaining some trophy sizes by now. Let us know, we can help.

SPC,

TJ has tons of experience in this area so I would strongly recommend implementing his advice.

I will throw in my limited experience as perhaps additional food for thought. I would consider no longer stocking the shiners and FHM (or reducing quantity) as their fusiform shape makes them more desirable to your predators than the BG and will be targeted first. IMO you need your predators focused on the small BG. If you don't want to introduce a new species such as SMB, is stocking more WE an option?

SPG

Sorry I misread your post...you have GSF, but no verified female BG yet - no BG reproduction? If that's the case I think you dodged a bullet. Still you could be seeing lepomis reproduction/recruitment of hybrid BG/RES, GSF or PS - but I don't think that's a bad thing. Good news is those F1 fish should be mostly male, and may not serve as a management issue at all provided you make an effort to keep population in check.

If you don't have BG reproduction in your fishery I think you may be able to manage the GSF without doing anything other than population management. Remove all GSF you can through angling, trapping, seining, and cast nets when fish are feeding. I think the opportunity to catch BG, HBG, PBG or BRES is pretty cool.

TJ, I can’t remember where I heard it, but I know I was told more than once. I put 250 in back in Sep of 2015. Sometimes they are a nuisance when trying to catch YP, but we just keep removing them. Biggest problem is when I grab a cold adult beverage, and jump in to cool off. It would appear mine are a BG Piranha cross..

Just keep in mind HBG are great additional species for angling return especially from younger anglers, their limited reproduction helps provide forage for YP and SMB, and their predation on YOY YP and SMB help prevent population management issues with either species. Further, it's nice to have a species that will continue to be active even into the hottest months of the year, and will readily approach a fly if you enjoy fly fishing. If you don't like them you don't like them, just my effort to demonstrate the benefits on the fishery, especially a cool water limited gape fishery. I think you got sound advice on the stocking strategy for whatever it's worth.

With GSF in a YP pond the YP population and minnow population will gradually decline as the GSF increase. The GSF and male BG will hybridize so you will get GSF and HBG. It takes a lot of manual effort to keep the GSF under control without LMB. High numbers of HSB and or SMB could help, but I have not experience with this combination. The main problem for GSF control for predators is the GSF prefer shallow shoreline cover. I gave up trying to control GSF with YP and walleye; it does not work. I think to get the fishery back to a decent balance you will need to add LMB. Keep us advised about your pond progress and success about what works and does not work. It will be educational.

Sounds like the problem is GSF and small BG....

Dang I need to slow down and more thoroughly review posts - thanks Bill.

If you're dealing with GSF and BG reproduction and want to retain your YP trophy fishery, I'd consider drain seine lime or consider the Male LMB stocking per my previous posts. HSB and WE won't manage your BG/GSF population so more dense stocking of either species isn't a viable solution in my experience.

I may look at stocking male LMB. How is it possible to source them with high degree of certainty? (Near 100%)

It is not easy and even experts make errors. It only takes one mistake to cause problems.

See this

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=441954&page=1

http://forums.pondboss.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=103583&page=1

Setterguy, Most likely, the HBG you stocked have spawned, and are reverting to their GSF origins....I know the fish I brought you were clean, and I seriously doubt NEMO had any GSF in their fish...Just stay your course still, and let the SMB hit about 4 pounds and keep removing all your HBG till then....besides, the grandkids stay busy fishing!!! Once the SMB average 4#+, the HBG/Fx will drop rapidly in mumbers.

Why? Are you HBG stunting? Did you read my posts above about the benefit of HBG? If Rex stands by their source/genetics, you should have 97% male - should not be posing a population management issue. HBG are a great companion to SMB/YP ponds, but Cody/etc. have suggested the benefit of refreshing genetics periodically with true F1 HBG to help prevent reverting to GSF genetics over the generations.

I would only purchase LMB from a hatchery selling single sex fish - either that or be very experienced and catch them on their bed and verify with milt the fish you're targeting. In your scenario I do not believe LMB are even remotely necessary - I still don't understand the nature of the management issue the HBG are posing.

Well, ok. I’ll leave well enough alone. For stocking 250, I sure have a lot. My SMB are no where near 4# though. I’ll keep removing every HBG I can. I mentioned in another thread about feeders that when mine goes off I see thousands of GSH fry in the 2-3” range. Should I maybe not feed, which would “possibly” encourage the SMB to go after HBG fry and GSH?
Biggest problem with HBG is swimming. My strain of HBG are very aggressive towards anyone in the pond.

Throw a cast net during feeding, you can probably remove 500 weekly.

I wouldn't stop feeding, that's when they are most vulnerable to predation from YP/SMB below. Also, if you have HBG might as well try to grow them into harvest or angling challenge size instead of leaving them slow growing/stunted. Feeding helps with both goals. If you're not already, I'd move your feedings to low light [dawn/dusk] conditions to help encourage HBG predation, they are far more vulnerable during these conditions when predators are active and can utilize low light for ambush advantage.

HSB may help manage HBG population, something to consider. If you stock them, recommend supplemental ladder stocking few fish annually.

I don't recall ever seeing a population management issue posted regarding HBG on the forum before...so this is all new to me. F1 HBG should be 97% male offspring....

Jeff...call me if you want. Happy to walk through what solutions I'd recommend and learn more about your situation. Contact info is listed on the forum

Thanks TJ. Appreciate the info. I’ll continue on with present feedings. I have feeder set to go off at those times, per your previous recommendations.

I have one large size LMB, about 16-17", probably came in Sept. 2015 with initial stocking of FHM. The other bass are quite a bit smaller.
This big one almost always comes up at feeding time, and hits a feeding BG in the 5-6 inch size. Don't know the LMB weight, but it looks very fat, probably over 2.5 pounds. It gets easy meals of tame feed trained BG.

Have you ever tried getting a video of it feeding? That would be fantastic I imagine.

[/quote] Have you ever tried getting a video of it feeding? That would be fantastic I imagine.[/quote]

That would be very hard to anticipate and capture. Water is not as clear this year as last. I'll try to get video.

Hi, Guys thanks for all the info, TJ yes I have real bluegill reproducing in my pond along with Green Sunfish, Draining my pond is not going to happen, I have been putting out traps and doing cast nets.. How does one tell the sex of a largemouth bass so I would only stock males?

You buy them from hatchery verified sex or catch them during spawn.