Pond Boss Magazine
https://www.pondboss.com/images/userfiles/image/20130301193901_6_150by50orangewhyshouldsubscribejpeg.jpg
Advertisment
Newest Members
Shotgun01, Dan H, Stipker, LunkerHunt23, Jeanjules
18,451 Registered Users
Forum Statistics
Forums36
Topics40,902
Posts557,116
Members18,452
Most Online3,612
Jan 10th, 2023
Top Posters
esshup 28,420
ewest 21,475
Cecil Baird1 20,043
Bill Cody 15,112
Who's Online Now
2 members (Dave Davidson1, jpsdad), 719 guests, and 204 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#150682 02/23/09 04:30 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
I've lived in my fairly new neighborhood for a little over 2 years now. Last year I found a 1/3 of an acre pond hidden in the back of the neighborhood. Its got a maximum depth of 6 feet and a very gently sloping shore. The pond was built as a storm water management pond when the neighborhood was first built in 2004. When I found the pond it had no fish in it of any kind. It seems to stay clear even after all but the heaviest of rains. There is no aquatic vegetation in the pond, YET. The shoreline is mostly surrounded by cattails and black willow, but I have kept a few pockets open to access to pond through.

Anyways, last year I stocked it with golden shiners, bluntnose minnows, banded killies, and gambusia. All have taken hold quite well and hopefully all will survive the winter and will be ready to spawn this spring.

I'm looking to add some kind of predatory fish community to the pond and am very open for ideas! Keep in mind, this isn't my personally owned pond, but is owned by my HOA. However, I think 90% of the neighborhood doesn't even know the thing exists and the 10% that do, couldn't care less if it did! So basically, its mine to toy with!

I will not be able to aerate it. I may have the ability to hand feed the fish but it most likely will not be a consistent thing so I would not add that into the equation. I will also most likely be stocking the pond using fish I catch, most likely using a seine but perhaps also with hook and line.

So, any ideas?

(Hey, I gotta get my pond fix somehow until I can build my own some day!)

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
Here's a satellite photo of the pond as well...



Joined: May 2008
Posts: 477
B
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
B
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 477
I'm partial to LMB, but since this is an experimental pond you could stock just about anything. I wonder how a Musky would do in there. \:D



Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,135
A
Ambassador
Lunker
Offline
Ambassador
Lunker
A
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 3,135
CJ, how about female only yellow perch, they can survive low oxygen in case of severe winter, and wouldn't multiply.



Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
Question is when will Mudcat Joe show up?

You'll always know what he did as he'll be hiding behind a tree just giggling.

I'd go path of least resistance and put a bunch of bluegill in there and maybe in the fall throw a couple of LMB in there.

If you could find YP or SMB, I'd mix them in also.

Even throwing in feed by hand when you can will help the forage base.


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
Yeah, I pray no one decides to do their own stocking experiment in the pond, but since the pond is not mine, I have no real control over it. But since the pond was around for 3 years before I found it and no fish were it in then, I am thinking I've got good odds that no mudcats will magically appear... Unless those pesky birds plant them! HAHA

The pond bottom is a clay/mud with one section of medium sized rocks to prevent erosion where the storm water rushes in. The bluntnose minnows seem to love the rocks for nesting under. I did sneak a couple pallets into the pond as well for spawning structure as well.

In my past experience in ponds this small, it is VERY hard to get a good balance going between LMB and BG. It seems to be one extreme or the other. With the clay/mud bottom I doubt I could get any SMB reproduction in the pond. I just don't know, maybe I will put a bunch of male GSF in there and go for a VA State record GSF?

I was also thinking of SMB(no worry of natural reproduction), male BG, and RES. Would be interesting to see if the male BG would spawn with some of the female RES. Anyone with experience in their hybrid?

Any other ideas???

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
A
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
A
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
VA groups their state record sunfish??
http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/fishing/trophy/staterecords.asp

Love the SMB, male BG, and RES strategy..

Are you telling the HOA? Guessing a sign posted might attract attention? Maybe make a sign that says "Dangerous Mercury Poisoning, do not fish or handle fish" \:\)

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
I wouldn't rule out SMB reproduction just because there is no rock substrate.

It's what the prefer, but when it comes down to it, the 'needs' of the fish might just prevail.


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
 Originally Posted By: AaronM


From looking at their records page, it does appear to be that way doesn't it? I know I have looked at it before, but I guess I forgot! Looks like I am gonna have to grow one large GSF! HAHA

The HOA isn't getting told a thing! The more quiet I stay about this the better. Although a sign that says mercury poisoning, fish consumption illegal may turn some heads! HAHA However, they got signs all around the Potomac River watershed warning about fish consumption and it doesn't slow people from eating fish there.

 Originally Posted By: Sunil
I wouldn't rule out SMB reproduction just because there is no rock substrate.

It's what the prefer, but when it comes down to it, the 'needs' of the fish might just prevail.


Yeah, I am hoping to minimize any reproduction by any species but the forage fish I have in there except for the RES. In a pond that small, it will make management much easier. So the mud bottom should keep the SMB from spawning, but ya just never know!

Anyone know how to accurately sex YP?

As of right now, I am thinking SMB, RES, male BG, male GSF and female YP if I can sex them. With no reproduction of all but the RES, I should be able to manage the pond to produce some large size sunfish and a few trophy SMB.

Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 13,689
Likes: 281
How will you get trophy SMB?

Will there be enough for them to eat?


Excerpt from Robert Crais' "The Monkey's Raincoat:"
"She took another microscopic bite of her sandwich, then pushed it away. Maybe she absorbed nutrients from her surroundings."

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
I just walked down to the pond today and it was teeming with GSH, bluntnose minnows, banded killies and mosquitofish that I could see... The water is VERY clear right now. I also stocked it with creekchub suckers, white suckers and tessellated darters last year with the other mentioned species. I just didn't see any of those three species today. I know all the species but the two sucker species spawned, so I think there will be plenty of food for the SMB to eat in the form of those forage fish I have in their now.

I think I will stock the sunfish this year and the SMB next year. As I remove the BG, GSF or SMB I will replace them.

The SMB will not have to rely on sunfish to feed themselves, only the forage fish. I feel with the substantial shallow water areas of the pond and cover, the SMB will not wipe the forage fish out but will still get plenty to eat. The few RES young that are born will provide additional food along with any hybrids between the RES, BG or GSF. I will keep the SMB to around 25 individuals. I'd probably stock around 50 RES, and 30 all male BG and 20 all male GSF. I will just have to be careful that I don't mix any female BG or GSF in or I will have a mess on my hands.

I know someone isn't gonna like the GSF idea, perhaps a fear they will compete with the SMB too much. The jury is still out on if I will include them in the mix...

Joined: May 2004
Posts: 13,939
Likes: 268
Moderator
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Lunker
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 13,939
Likes: 268
 Originally Posted By: CJBS2003
I will just have to be careful that I don't mix any female BG or GSF in or I will have a mess on my hands.

I was just thinking that.


"Live like you'll die tomorrow, but manage your grass like you'll live forever."
-S. M. Stirling
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,028
Likes: 274
D
Moderator
Lunker
Online Content
Moderator
Lunker
D
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 16,028
Likes: 274
GSF make pretty poor competitors. With the exception of some who have kept other stocking numbers low, they seldom last. They are gone from my pond and I miss them. They are pretty and will outfight a BG everytime.


It's not about the fish. It's about the pond. Take care of the pond and the fish will be fine. PB subscriber since before it was in color.

Without a sense of urgency, Nothing ever gets done.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley Rancher and Farmer Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
A
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
A
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
How about orange-spotted sunfish? Dr. Willis mentioned them for a smallie pond. or pumpkinseeds? You've got quite the mix of fish!

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,475
Likes: 264
E
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
Offline
Moderator
Hall of Fame 2014
Lunker
E
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 21,475
Likes: 264

















Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
A
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
A
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
Thanks Eric, these are perfect smb food..



Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
Orange spotted sunfish are pretty no doubt but full grown are only about 6" and I have no wild source to collect from around here... I may include a few male PSS into the mix as well. I figure as long as they are just males, I can darn near mix in as many sunfish species as I want without too crazy a repercussion... My experience with GSF is much the same. I had a pond that the only fish in it were GSF and redfin pickerel. I stocked CC, LMB and BG into it. Within 3 years, the pond went from millions of stunted 3-4 inch GSF to almost no GSF. Every once in a while you'd catch a real nice GSF but they got real rare. I think me stocking adult male GSF, I could keep them around. With no reproduction from any game fish but the RES I don't think they'll be out competed.

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
A
Lunker
Offline
Lunker
A
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 325
The benefit of the OSS was the small size, good size for forage for smallies and won't mess with your other forage. I can't believe you can't find them wild! You're the wild collecting specialist! \:\)

If you're going to have mixed sex RES with male BG and male GSF you're probably going to get some hybrids.

Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
C
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
OP Offline
Ambassador
Field Correspondent
Hall of Fame
Lunker
C
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 10,458
Likes: 2
OSS aren't native to eastern drainages and they apparently never sparked the USFWS to stock them back in the late 1800's when they seemed to stock everything else.

I am guessing you are right about the hybridization. That is the only real monkey wrench...


Link Copied to Clipboard
Today's Birthdays
cro, HC1968
Recent Posts
Relative weight charts in Excel ? Calculations?
by esshup - 03/29/24 01:06 AM
pond experience needed
by esshup - 03/29/24 12:45 AM
New pond middle TN: establishing food chain?
by Bill Cody - 03/28/24 07:57 PM
Happy Birthday Bob Lusk!!
by FireIsHot - 03/28/24 07:33 PM
Working on a .5acre disaster, I mean pond.
by PRCS - 03/28/24 06:39 PM
Fungus infection on fish
by nvcdl - 03/28/24 06:07 PM
Can anyone ID these minnows?
by Dylanfrely - 03/28/24 05:43 PM
1 year after stocking question
by esshup - 03/28/24 04:48 PM
Yellow Perch Spawn 2024
by H20fwler - 03/28/24 04:29 PM
New 2 acre pond stocking plan
by LANGSTER - 03/28/24 03:49 PM
Paper-shell crayfish and Japanese snails
by esshup - 03/28/24 10:39 AM
Newly Uploaded Images
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
Eagles Over The Pond Yesterday
by Tbar, December 10
Deer at Theo's 2023
Deer at Theo's 2023
by Theo Gallus, November 13
Minnow identification
Minnow identification
by Mike Troyer, October 6
Sharing the Food
Sharing the Food
by FishinRod, September 9
Nice BGxRES
Nice BGxRES
by Theo Gallus, July 28
Snake Identification
Snake Identification
by Rangersedge, July 12

� 2014 POND BOSS INC. all rights reserved USA and Worldwide

Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5