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#510568 08/20/19 07:57 PM
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I really appreciate all the good advice everyone has provided and I have been reading a lot on this forum. My FHM are doing excellent and I have seen different sized fry along the shore. I have a heron that is visiting the pond on a regular basis now. At least I haven't seen a lot of snakes or turtles yet.

My question is when I stock my fish this spring, what size SMB and HSB should I try to get? The HBG and RES will be 1-2" and I may add some pumpkinseed too. Should I wait a year before adding predators or add everything at once? Also, how many fish should I stock; pond is a 1/2 acre.

Thank you,

5444


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My 2 cents here..
Stock HBG, RES in spring, let them get off a good spawn if stocked early enough they will spawn at 3-4", OR... stock 3-4" and they will for sure spawn then add smb and hsb in fall. IF 1-2" HBG and RES are all that's available I believe I would be inclined to give them a year and stock HSB and SMB late the next summer/early fall.
For .5 ac., I'd go 200-250 HBG, 100-150 RES. 30-35 SMB and 10-15 HSB.
I would highly recommend you stock 2-3lbs of crawdads too.. Your SMB will have a hard time making a good living on HBG and RES.

Last edited by Snipe; 08/20/19 10:15 PM.
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Your HSB will be pellet trained, not sure on SMB but if you're going to supplement with pellets you can relieve some pressure on your forage base for a period of time.
My SMB were NOT feed trained but this years hatch tears up the feed, whether I have any left or not after my flood is yet to be seen.
On size of SMB and HSB, 4" is great but SMB ain't cheap.
My thought is start small so you know YOU have control over growth rates on SMB. HSB probably going to be whats available at the time. Late summer you'll see 2-8" SMB available, so If you buy in late summer go the biggest you can afford for that year class.

Last edited by Snipe; 08/20/19 10:28 PM.
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Be careful buying fish in the Spring...often hatcheries are dumping their inferior runts approaching age 1. Genetics is vastly important. Unless 6-8" HSB and SMB are available in Spring, take a pass until the Fall when fish that size are available. Resist the temptation to save money on the Spring fire sales from hatcheries - initial stocking is no place to cut corners considering the vast time, effort, and fiscal resources dedicated to the pond development.


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TJ,
what would one look out for if they were trying to avoid the "fire sale" inferior gene fish?
How do you know if you've already made the mistake?


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Fish size in Spring is the key -

"Unless 6-8" HSB and SMB are available in Spring, take a pass until the Fall when fish that size are available."

Does this make sense? Those Spring fish are approaching age 1, should be much larger. Hatcheries dump their runts of the year the following Spring. If a hatchery tries to sell you 2-3" SMB in the Spring those are nearly age 1 fish - should be at least 5 up to 8" by then. Same goes for CP, BG, LMB, WE, etc. Watch Spring fish sales...


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Ok, got it. Thanks for the clarification.
That stinks, I was really hoping to get my BG started in the spring. It's a new pond, so blank canvas.
I was planning stocking BG in spring, LMB/CC in fall. Given your advice, stock all three at same time in the fall? hoping to get a better genetic crop?


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FLX...I think the key here is to make sure you don't get excited about a LOW cost sale and get runts. I bought my HBG (3-5")and HSB (4-6")in late april and they have done very well. Yes, they were 8 to 10 months old, but they were not runts. Smaller fish than the ones I bought would have been the results of late spawns OR runts from earlier spawns from the previous year.

Now, if you are trying to totally maximize your fishery (to the extreme), buying smaller young fish (1 inchers) in the fall makes a difference. They are young (a month old). This means you get as much of their life to influence for maximum growth. To the average pond hobbyist, like myself, a few months isn't going to matter.

Going with larger fish (3-6") in the spring helps eliminate getting runty fish. Waiting until fall for smaller fish (1-2") will allow your FHM's to do more of what they do and may even make up for stocking larger fish in the spring.

As far as stocking panfish first and the predators later versus at the same time...it depends on what your goals are. Do you want larger panfish or larger predators? The numbers of each also depends on this along with size availability at the time of stocking.


Fish on!,
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5444, sorry for hijacking your thread. I hope my rabbit trail has helped with your original question.
QA, thanks for the additional thoughts. I want fun fishing, and a sustainable fishery. I'm really not that interested in trophy anything today. I just want the pond to look and feel natural and beautiful, and be fun to be around. Fatheads are going in as soon as the mud settles, so they should have a month or two before it gets too cold to do their thing.
In the wet part of the spring, i'll be putting fatheads in every puddle see. some will make it into the pond, most will get picked off by birds, but hopefully they'll eat their worth in flying vampire babies.


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Snipe, What type of crawdads should I stock and from where?


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What state is your pond in 5444?

I ask, because Missouri only allows the Northern Virile crawdad to be sold in the state and they are hard to source for sale. The reintroduction of otters has hurt many fisheries that normally raised them. They are native to the state and have worked in my pond very well, bucket stocked from a nearby creek.


Fish on!,
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Illinois


5444
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Virile (similar to papershell) is good anywhere conditions allow.
Hartley's in Central KS sells them but he gets them elsewhere. I'll find out where but I'm thinking he told me NE. TJ may have a source in northeast NE as well.

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In order for your crawdad installation to have a chance...you need plenty of rock along the banks and lower down in case your water level dips. I lined about 20% of my shore with baseball to football sized creek rock from the waterline down 3 feet. This has worked well. My only problem is that the HSB don't seem to be thinning them. My overabundance of craws has impacted plant growth and may be adding to my muddy water issues...I still like them, but may add the token LMB to grow fat on them.


Fish on!,
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Originally Posted By: Quarter Acre
FLX...I think the key here is to make sure you don't get excited about a LOW cost sale and get runts. I bought my HBG (3-5")and HSB (4-6")in late april and they have done very well. Yes, they were 8 to 10 months old, but they were not runts. Smaller fish than the ones I bought would have been the results of late spawns OR runts from earlier spawns from the previous year.

Now, if you are trying to totally maximize your fishery (to the extreme), buying smaller young fish (1 inchers) in the fall makes a difference. They are young (a month old). This means you get as much of their life to influence for maximum growth. To the average pond hobbyist, like myself, a few months isn't going to matter.

Going with larger fish (3-6") in the spring helps eliminate getting runty fish. Waiting until fall for smaller fish (1-2") will allow your FHM's to do more of what they do and may even make up for stocking larger fish in the spring.

As far as stocking panfish first and the predators later versus at the same time...it depends on what your goals are. Do you want larger panfish or larger predators? The numbers of each also depends on this along with size availability at the time of stocking.


Precisely. You wouldn't want to jump and buy 2" YP or 3" SMB or WE in the Spring [these fish spawn in the Spring] - these are nearly age 1 fish and should be double/triple the size. Buying fish in the Spring is fine, I'd just verify size is appropriate so you're not helping the hatchery bail themselves out and you get to short end. BG are different as they can spawn anywhere from May-October in NE - so 2" fish in the Spring would be OK considering they were only growing for a couple months. Problem is one cannot verify they're sourcing BG a few months old [October spawn], or age 1 fish [May spawn]. That's why we always advise PB members to be careful with Spring fish sales - provided the size is right, Spring fish are fine. Just be conscientious.



Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after. ~ Henry David Thoreau

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No worries muck man.


5444

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