Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations considering purchasing property with pond

I’m looking at a 70 acre piece of property in central SC that has what is being advertised as a 10 acre stocked pond. My wife and I went up and looked at the property ourselves this past weekend and are planning on meeting with the realtor later this week to get more info. I want to be as informed as possible before meeting with him. I’ve always wanted to live on a piece of property that I could fish on and enjoy the outdoors with my kids and this looks like it could be that place. I’ve fished my whole life (until the kids came along in recent years) but have no experience with building/maintaining ponds. I’ll tell you what I know about the place and what my concerns are and try to keep it brief.

According to the realtor the pond was put in between 8 and 10 years ago. The work was done with the land owner’s supervision and his equipment but he hired people to do the labor. I asked if the land owner got the proper permits and I was told he did. I did notice that there was an area near the southeastern corner of the pond that has a particularly steep bank that has fallen into the pond. Not sure if I should be concerned about this or not. I think this is near the dam but not part of it. There is a creek that flows into it but the creek is hard to follow on aerial maps so the creek may be spring fed.

There is a small concrete spillway over the dam and it looks like there is a vertical drainpipe protruding from the water so that is what dictates the water height. Are there things I should look for that would indicate that this dam was built properly and will be trouble free for decades? I intend to ask for any pictures that the landowner may have taken while the pond was being built. This whole area of SC got substantial rains last year and a lot of roads and bridges were damaged and it would appear this dam made it through ok.

I have no clue on depths but there was a lot of vegetation(my guess is southern naiad) around the 3/4s of the lake we could get to for the first 5-10 feet or so from the bank. I was concerned however when I noticed a jon boat that had a long stick next to it with a make shift duct tape handle on one end. It was about 7 feet long and I would assume that’s what’s used to push the jon boat around the pond. My concern is that the pond is only 6 feet deep at the deepest point which seems too shallow. There was also a small paddle by the boat so maybe the pond is deeper in some spots. Prior to looking at it the realtor told us the land owner had lowered the water level by removing some panels from the spillway(I think that’s what he said). The pond didn’t look low to us so I’m not sure what he was referring to.

There is a dock on the pond which has a feeder on it; solar powered. It had feed in it. My concern there is I wouldn’t expect to still be feeding fish that were put in about 8 years earlier. I would think that would only be necessary for the first year or so until the ecosystem gets established. I don't want a 10 acre aquarium that I have to constantly feed fish. I intend to also ask about what/when stocking was done. I know for sure there are LMB and BG in the pond. While we were there we threw a few handfuls of the pellets into the water and were surprised when fish didn’t respond very quickly. After a few minutes we noticed them taking the pellets but even then it was slow. Would this indicate the fish don’t rely too much on the pellets or that there isn’t a very healthy population of fish in the pond?

I guess my main concerns are that the pond was built properly. By that I mean I won’t have to repair the dam or spillways any time soon and that it will be a good habitat for the wildlife to thrive in. What are the questions I need to ask to ensure this? Thanks for any advice. Whether or not we get this property we plan on getting something with a pond so I’m very excited to have found this very active forum.

Welcome to PB!

Feeding fish is optional, but can be do for the life of the pond to improve fish #s and quality, but not required. I really enjoy feeding but it could get expensive if you fed 10 acres, with 3 or more feeders. One feeder you can feed as often or as much as you like.

AS far as pond construction and depth, I'm not sure there is much way to tell potential problems after it is full of water. Depth is important and the less water shallower than 4' the better. Best just to ask or get a boat on it to find out. I would be surprised if it was only 6-8' deep.

Ponds and trouble free are rarely in the same sentence.

Thanks for the comments Brian. Very good point. Maybe trouble free was a strong request. I just want to avoid any major catastrophes. Fortunately there don't seem to be any structures downstream, it's mostly timberland.

Maybe a better plan would be to find someone that is experienced with man made ponds that would be willing to do an inspection of it for me prior to purchase. I think I can find pond construction companies in the area but are pond inspections a service that these folks commonly provide, for a small fee of course? Like you mentioned though it may be near impossible with the pond full and there may be reasons someone might not want to give their blessing to a pond they didn't build for liability reasons.

As far as depth, I've noticed on a few websites, including on SC dept of natural resources, pond depth is only recommended up to 6-8 feet. This has to do with the amount of DO in the water greater than 8 feet and the possibility of turnover that can cause kill off. I've been reading up on here peoples ponds being 15-20' or more. Maybe those kind of depths are only necessary in areas that are susceptible to freezing over.

There are several on here than actually know this stuff and build and design ponds for a living, but till they chime in:).

If you are talking dam failure, then you could have someone come out and verify elevations are correct for your spillway and plenty of freeboard for the amount of inflow/spillway/overflow. If it has handled recent very heavy rains, like we have had around here, it is probably good or would have already had an issue.

Overflow pipes can be a source of headache. If they rust out, that leaves a void for water to flow and cause problems. You can always fill it and install a bottom siphon if need later on if you ever have a issue.

Also I would bet the 7' paddle was for standing in boat and paddling.

Based on what you have said, I don't like it. 6 to 8 ft might be OK until or when you get a drought. And shallow ponds are known for weed issues. I'm afraid that you will be using a lot of chemicals to nuke the weeds. When plant life dies, it sucks O2. The fish need the oxygen. So, you will be stuck with nuking a part of the pond at a time. As the weeds die, they can fertilize the others and it keeps going.

It sounds like a headache to me. PERSONALLY, I would pass.

jonese, welcome to the forum.

Before I got too vested in this property, I might take a look at the historical view of the pond on Google Earth. What I'd want to see is the top 4-5 acres of the pond, and see how the water level has fluctuated during the last 8-10 years. If the previous owner lowered the pond, I'd sure want to know why. It might be worth having the dam looked at by a professional before any decisions are made.

My pond's almost identical in size, shape, and depth to the one you're looking at, and DD1 hit a lot of the issues in his post. Larger shallow water ponds can be a handful to say the least. Having said all that, it's a beautiful place. I might have a hard time not thinking about buying it too.

Some of your comments are hard to read. It's hard not to get attached to a place that's got everything you want. It looks like the main concern is the depth so that'll be my first question. Just to clarify, I have no clue how deep the pond is. I was only guessing that based on the push pole by the boat. As far as vegetation being an issue; and again I don't have the info from the property owner what measures he's taken in the past if any, but the only vegetation I see stops about 5-10 from the shore. Makes fishing from shore with an exposed hook difficult but doesn't seem like a big cause of concern(to my uneducated self).

Just for my education, is the major concern of a "shallow" pond(6-8 feet) the over abundance of aquatic vegetation? I guess the other issue being maintaining adequate depths during droughts.

The oldest aerial view I can find of the pond looks just like the more recent photos. I don't see any changes in size or noticeable vegetation.

Ponds are like batteries, in that they both provide storage. Batteries store amperage, (okay, taking some liberties with that one), and the larger the battery, the more amperage it might deliver. Ponds store oxygen, and the deeper they are the more reserve capacity (more battery talk), of O2 they can supply.

Deep has the potential for more oxygen. Fish need oxygen.

The pond has been there 8 to 10 years, one good indicator IMO. Is it full? Have you walked the backside of the dam looking for issues? Too many weeds?....I would ask the realtor if the seller would allow you to go fishing before your buy...

Welcome to the forum!

Appears 1/3 of the pond is already silting in according to the photo - dense vegetation due to siltation from the draw. 1/3 of the pond is essentially useless from a fishing standpoint for several months a year, and I fear the remainder of the pond will slowly follow suit and become even more shallow. When I help clients design ponds, we install sediment dikes in the creek arms/draws to help slow down water, allow particulate to drop, which results in cleaner water to travel to the pond - thus slowing the siltation rate. Every few years a backhoe can get on the dikes and excavate accumulated material around the wings and start over clean. Appears as though this was not installed during pond construction.

Per other's feedback, I fear a constant struggle to manage vegetation in a pond like this, and it could become more of a pain than a pleasure - which is not what you want. Personally, I'd keep looking. If your heart is set on it, I'd at least get a quote for excavation work to increase depth and install some sediment wing dikes following a lake drawdown. Not sure it's worth the investment unless you can operate equipment yourself...but worth researching.

Just my thoughts - welcome again to the forum - glad you found us!

I appreciate you all sharing your experience and knowledge with me. With not a clue as to what it would cost to do the improvements mentioned and possibly having to drain pond and remove sediment/dig deeper, I wonder if it would be more cost effective to start with something like this that needs work or start completely from scratch.

The area we're looking in doesn't have a lot of ponds and even fewer places with ponds that are for sale. However, there are numerous small creeks and swampy areas which was what this place started out as I'm sure. It would be very easy to find a place that has some low lying wetlands that could be turned into a pond. But it would seem like it would be more costly and more of a headache(getting permitting etc) to start from scratch.

Would you guys take the gamble and purchase a place with an amateur built pond as a good starting point or would you look at places without a pond and plan on building one? I fear if we get a place without a pond it'll probably never get built.

Got a little update from the realtor. There weren't any pictures taken during construction unfortunately but the property owner says the riser pipe is 12 feet at the dam with the deepest parts of the pond being between 15-18 feet with the average depth being 8-10 feet. Sounds promising. Don't know what the riser pipe being at 12 feet means.

It might make sense to verify the depths.

Well if you are a serious buyer then "take a test drive". Just as you would with an automobile, test that pond if the pond is a major factor in your investment in that parcel.

Meet the realtor with your kayak, fishing gear, and depth finder. If you present yourself as a serious buyer and explain that the pond is a key factor given that it will be an ongoing expense (maintenance, what if dam breaks, insurance, etc.) you must verify for yourself that the depth is there, the health of the pond (via fishing, paddling about checking out plants, etc.) etc.

I won't implicate myself, but I know of someone who has gained access to out of reach ponds and lakes as a perspective buyer.

Don't take anyone's word, even if they have pictures and receipts. It is like a home, you do a home inspection even though they show you receipts and photos. Treat that pond the same way.

Great advice basslover.

jonese, I would verify the depths. You can pull up Google Earth, and look at historical imagery to see if the pond holds water and stays at that "full" level consistently. That will allow you to look back in time a number of years. Around Greensboro images go back to the mid 1990's. I agree about taking a boat out and verifying depths. When I bought this place I was told the pond was "X" deep. It turned out to be less than half of that depth.

I have a different take on it. Here's my thoughts.

If you want to buy a property and build a pond of comparable size, then go for that one. To start from scratch you would have to figure out a way to dispose of all the dirt and you will have a "construction" site for at least a year. Then you have to seed grass, stock fish and wait.

Worst case would be that pond doesn't 100% meet your goals, and needs to be renovated. I don't think you would be out any more $$ to renovate that one as it would be to dig a new one, and most likely less.

With a pond that large, you don't have to manage all the weeds in it, just the ones that become objectionable in the areas that you want to use. At 10 years of age, you still have around 10+ years with the drain pipe before it rusts through, if it is a corrugated metal drain pipe.

If the fish population isn't what you want, partially drain, rotenone and restock. The money spend doing that would be considerably less than digging a new pond and stocking it.

If the pond has a lot of muck on the bottom, then if there is a way to drain, push out the muck and basically push the reset button, then I think you would still be ahead of the game. You can still add the sediment traps and other things that TJ mentioned, just like you would do if digging a new pond, on a new piece of property that didn't have a pond.

If the rest of the property is what you are looking for, go for it. That is what my take is on the property.

Thank you esshup. I think you nailed my thoughts which are starting with a pond and having to renovate/restore would most likely be easier and cheaper than starting from nothing. Not to mention I wouldn't have to worry about permitting even if I had to drain it and rework the bottom(at least I don't think I would need to).

My wife hit on something the other day too which was if we get a place that doesn't already have a pond, most likely we'll never build one. Sad reality because we looked at another place last week that I really liked and had the perfect site for a pond. Those kind of placed are more plentiful than the ones that already have ponds.

This place is far from a done deal at this point. We did meet with the realtor last week and talked about some of our concerns. We're waiting to hear back this week after he talks with the land owner. Then we need to meet with a home builder to make sure we can get the house we want nestled in near the pond, check that a barn and pasture can fit where we need it, and see if we can secure a land loan. A lot still needs to fall into place.

I appreciate everyone's input so far.

The reality about renovating a pond is that it costs about the same $$ amount as digging one from scratch. It's harder and more time consuming to deal with all the soupy muck than if the dirt was dry.

To renovate a dammed pond, a breach in the dam is made at the deepest point so any water can run out, and continue to run out during the process. Then all the muck is moved out of the basin. It needs to dry to be pushed with a dozer, or it's like trying to push stew off of a table with a spoon - it keeps spreading out behind you. It's a PITA to work with until it is dry, and depending on the weather and depth of muck, it might take a year to dry.

About renovating a pond: Mine was renovated a little over a year ago. I had no real choice but to renovate or not have a pond. No permit needed to clean out, and we were able to enlarge a bit also. Because of the trees and brush in and around the pond, it could not easily be determined what the original size was, exactly. There is no other place on the land to build a pond where permitting or technical difficulties would not be a problem. As for the sludge, we pushed it out into the field adjacent to, and out of the watershed of the pond. It dried for a year, and week before last I hired a small bulldozer to come in and clean up and shape the sludge pile so it could become part of the hay field. Some of it was pushed against the back of the dam to create a gentle slope where needed, and the rest flattened. I have seeded it very heavily and the sludge should be only a memory next summer. The total cost for the clean out, building the small sediment pond above the main pond, and clean up including seeding and burying the stumps and ashes was about $3,650 for the 1/4 acre pond and 17,500 gallon sediment/minnow pond.

That sounds better if you have good run-off/water-shed, but like someone said I would verify with a depth finder. Before we bought our property we had Mike Otto come out for a consultation about the pond. It's definitely worth the money to have a full-time professional pond building expert give a pre-purchase evaluation. It sounds like it is a unique property in your area and you really like the over-all picture...so hire an expert and use that info to verify and/or possibly negotiate a better deal on the property. Good Luck!

Why do you say that you find a perfect place and it has a good place for a pond to go in, that you would sadly not go through with building it? Seems like if you find the right place with all the other parameters in place that building a pond is always an option? Even if it is a groundwater pond with a liner or polymer seal you have the option to add one later.

If you read lots of posts here you will find that sometimes putting your house and pasture in, then learning the lay of the land, where water puddles up and also just live there a bit you then find out that you might want a waterfall or maybe you want a few smaller forage ponds and one swimming pond, or maybe 2 medium sized ponds, to experiment with 2 different fisheries side by side, etc.

Maybe in your state is different, but in our state, if you create a hole in the ground, make it hold water, and be sure it has no place where a body of water, creek, stream, etc has inflow and outflow then the state has no jurisdiction over it which avoids a lot of hassles.

If the price is right buy the property. Everything with the pond management can be fixed. The feeder feeding a 10 acre pond I don't expect you have many takers anyways. You would need 6 or more to push that acreage. I am betting its there just so they can sit and watch some action.

If the property leaves it self up for a home some day its worth every penny the property is being ask for. One thing is that land is always going up faster then inflation. There not making any more of it.

Cheers Don.

I just had a long reach excavator at my place for 3 days digging out a bunch of shallow areas. The thing could reach out 60'. With a little dirt pushed up here and there he was able to reach ALL of the shallow areas I wanted gone. I was thinking about using him for 4 days but he got more done in 3 days than I was hoping to do total. I do have the advantage that letting the sludge sit for a year before we move it is not a problem. The price for all this was fairly reasonable to me.

I'd like to have some of that done sometime.

I'm assuming with that type of equipment it costs about $800-$1000 per day in Texas to have something like that done? Then ya gotta get rid of the mud.