Pond Boss Forums INTRO Questions & Observations introduce desirable plants in 50 acre pond?

Hey yall...I have enjoyed reading this forum for a while and decided to stop being a voyeur. I recently leased the rights to a 50 acre pond in upstate sc. This pond was built in 98 by the current owners father. The son cares absolutely NOTHING about fishing or ponds and is not willing to spend any money or "waste" any time with management issues. I have fished this pond 18 times since June of last year and appears to be in good shape. My wife and I are strictly catch and release Bass fisherpeople. Anyway my first question (among many to follow) is about plants. This pond drops off very quickly... I don't know the correct rate 3-1...5-1 etc but I can tell you that around 90% of the edge it is normally 10-15 ft deep within 20-30-ft. The pond is completely devoid of structure and plants with the exception of a 100+ ft dock. I have noticed lots of grass carp rolling around the edge but I have no idea what they are eating?? I think this pond would benefit from some plant life but don't want to spend a lot of money or waste a lot of time on what could only be considered a "rental" Sorry for the long post but I wanted to give a little info so I could get some good input. If you have any advice or questions feel free. THANKS FFF!!!

Welcome to Pond Boss. Post some pictures of your lake if you can. Sounds like a great place.

I think 50 acres qualifies for "LAKE" status..

Thanks for the welcome. Being brand new I'm not yet adept at uploading stuff yet..but for a birdseye the lat-lon . This "lake" has maintained a constant water level through flood and drought, has a light green color and the secchi disk disapears @ 20+". Can I cheaply add some plants (milfoil, lily pads' bulrush) that the carp won't eat. BTW this pond was stocked with lmb-bg-cc and crappie (sorry I don't know the initials for those) in 98 and I have accidentally caught several cc's on Shad Raps. Thanks again for any help-suggestions etc.FFF

With the GC (grass carp) in there it will be hard to get plants established. Don't put in milfoil - it's an invasive species and will overtake areas where it grows quickly, and make those areas unfishable.

If there isn't any cover in the lake (brush piles, etc.) then I'd talk to the landowner and see if you can add some. In the archives, there are a few threads on how to build them and many suggestions on what to use for material. There's also a thread on fish acronyms.

I can do anything (within reason) to the pond that I see fit. I have already constructed and placed several brush piles. We have caught 200+ lmb in the 18 trips we have made since 06/10 but only a handful over 18" mostly 10-15" which is ok but I would like to turn up the volume on the growth rate over time and even though this is a lease I still anticipate having exclusive access for several years, I would simply fertilize but rather costly for a leased pond. What about introducing forage...tiliapia? GSH? crayfish? frshwater shrimp? would any of those have a chance to get a foothold and be self maintaining or simply be immediatley eaten??? BTW I have been fishing HARD since 69 and if there were lmb in this pond in the double digits I probably would have caught one of them by now.(this is where I blush and look at the floor) Just for fun and to prove I'm not a poser your welcome to view my Facebook page Kenneth Sale and click on albums!!
PLANTS?????FORAGE????STRUCTURE?????? THANKS FFF

I'm sure others will chime in that have a better handle than I do on managing a lake in your area, but here's some food for thought, and a few questions, so please bear with me.

What are your goals for the lake?

What sizes are the other fish that are in the lake? Do other people fish the lake? Do you know, or can you find out how many of each species was stocked? It might not make any difference because of the 11 year span tho. The secchi disc readings are good if the stated clarity is due to plankton and not turbidity. Is there any way that you can do a seine survey?

Is the lake far south enough that Threadfin shad would survive? Considering we don't know your budget, I don't know if stocking them (by the truckload) would be in the cards.

Do you have an accurate fish scale that will weigh in ounces? The next time you are fishing there, take a weight and length of every LMB that you catch, and record it. It'll help with the management direction. The best way to get a handle on it is to have the BOW electroshocked, but considering that you don't own it, you might not want to go to that expense.

We've discussed carrying capacity here, and for a BOW that is not aerated and that doesn't have a supplemental food program going on, IIRC a BOW can hold 250#-400# per surface acre. That's for all fish in the BOW, not top of the line predators.

It takes 10# of forage to put one pound on one LMB, so I don't know if it would be feasible to stock forage fish in any quantity that would do you any good. i.e. to put 1# on each of those LMB that you caught since 6/10, you would have to stock at least 2,000# of forage fish in the 4"-7" size range. Stocking smaller fish will just feed the smaller LMB. The larger LMB will expend more energy chasing smaller fish to fill their bellies.

If certain year classes of LMB are skinny (under 100% WR), it might mean that the LMB are starting to eat themselves out of house and home, with help from the Crappie. If that's the case, you'll have to change tactics and go from to a C&R guy to a C&E (catch and eat) guy and bring a LOT of friends to fish it.

In a BOW of that size, and with the GC in there, I doubt that you will be able to get any non-invasive plant species established that will help the LMB fishery.

I think your better off adding cover to the BOW because the GC can't eat it. Typically, up to 20% of the surface acreage of the BOW should be cover for the fish. The cover should be spread out over different areas, travel routes, next to spawning areas, etc. Pallets, brush piles, PVC trees & porcupines, etc. all come under the cover heading. I doubt that you will be able to add structure to the BOW. That is typically built into the pond when it's constructed, i.e. dropoffs, creek channels, underwater islands, humps, etc. Now is a good time to hit all the x-mas tree lots and see if they have any left over trees.

Here's some additional reading for ya.

Cover and structure

fish population analysis

Carryng Capacity

Relative Weight Charts

Acronyms

Hey Esshup thanks for the help
I don't an exact plan perse. I guess the "short" answer is that I really want my wife to catch some(a) double digit bass. she is my second and last wife and 15 years younger than me and a city girl. We've been married 18 yrs and she only started enjoying fishing in 08. I insisted she get in the boat with me one late spring day when I KNEW she could easily catch 20-30+ bass on an ultralight wacky worm and crankbaits....well she did and it was like a lightbulb went off and the next day I bought her a shimano stradic ci4 2500 and a cumulus rod. She has been a regular boat buddy ever since and is a quick learner. Most of the ponds I have access to are private and isolated, most require 4wd to get to or have houses all along the shore. The former makes her nervous even though she trusts me and the truck. The latter provide her with very little privacy to pee.(or worse) I have a bass boat with all the bells and whistles except for a toilet. The pond in question is easy to get to, close to home and affords her some privacy.
I've never seen a crappie from this pond, the cc's Ive caught were 2-3lbs, last june I could see hoards of yoy bg's everywhere around the shore. During my initial conversation with the owner he said that His father had stocked only with the fish I listed using the #'s given to him by the county extension agent. However he did mention that his brother did a lot of "bucket biology" during the first few years (mostly lmb) He told me and showed me pictures of the ponds record fish:lmb 12-2, bg 4+,cc 9+, crappie 5+.
In 18 days in the boat fishing from 6-10 hrs each day I've never seen another fisherman...boat or bank...however i have noticed a couple of trails down to the water for someone could stand and fish. Turbidity not a problem at all. I suppose I could pull a seine through it but as i said before the topography of this pond is such that you could float wilt chamberlains hat within 3 steps of the shore. I have a scale and tape and all of the fish I have caught were very healthy and were the right weight (or better) for their length. I would Love to put Treadfin in, they survive just fine in Lake Wylie just 30 mins north. I would like to talk more about this option.I retired after selling motorcycles atvs and personal watercraft for many years so it's not really a budget issue it's cost benefit thing. If i knew I could put 5k worth of shad in this spring and see lots of FFFat bass pulling my wifes rod double I wouldn't bat an eye. I am going to continue sinking trees and pvc throughout the winter, it sure can't hurt.I'll do some research on the shad and see where that goes. Oh this lake does have a beautifully diverse bottom contour, mostly hard red clay and rocks but again its all more than 15 ft+ below the surface and well below the thermocline which usually sets up around 12 ft! So its interesting to look at on the Lowrance but nothing much in the way of fish other than the occaisonal rouge cc.
Thanks again FFF

FFF, sounds like you have a good idea what you want. I sent you a PM, look next to "My Stuff" near the top of the page and click on the envelope.

If you feel like taking a road trip, there will be a Pond Boss Conference in MO in April. Fishing tourney and all. Go here for details.

findfoolfight....is this it?

yes-aint it a beaut!!!

Yezzzir...looks really nice with trees surrounding a lot of it. I hope ya got a long-term lease so you can treat it like it's your own. I am already brain-storming trying to decide the place I would put a house.

hOME IS WHERE YOUR HAT IS? HEART IS? TV IS? FRIG IS? TRUCK IS? DOG IS?BED IS? GUN IS? WIFE IS? POND IS? DID I LEAVE ANYTHING OUT?

Zep this property (684) acres is currently for sale! $3.3m 60+ acres of water 100+acres of pasture with the balance in planted pines and hardwoods. You picked a great place to build your house. It's hard to tell from this photo but your site would sit on the top of a berm facing south with a 200 ft walk and a 40 ft drop out to the tip of that nipple shaped rocky point. There you could build a gazebo and a feeder and go out every morning with the sun warming your left cheek and drink a fresh cup of columbian and watch a fat 8 lb'r smash the #9 rapala you've been expertly twitchin!
Sweet Dreams FFF

Slightly out of my budget at this time.
But if the Iraqi Dinar revals or I hit
the lottery I will let ya know.