Carp fishing for sport has gotten huge down here in Texas. I am toying with the idea of turning one of my ponds into a carp fishery. Common Carp. One of my ponds already has several big carp in it , along with small bass and sunfish.
Anybody here have any ideas about managing a pond for trophy carp?
Good for you. I'm glad you're going to try something out of the ordinary.
My first impression is that all of the concepts are the same.
1. Keep them wet.
2. Never let them run out of oxygen.
3. Don't let them swim in lots of their own waste.
4. Figure out what they like to eat. I'm sure they like big invertebrates. I'd be surprised if they don't like pellets, but I'm not sure about this.
5. Limit their reproduction so their not all competing for the same resources.
Now maybe somebody who knows what they're talking about can chime in.
Good luck with this one. I'm glad you're doing it.
Tell me this: What is the difference in a Carp, LMB or Mako Shark on the end of a line? So, yeah! Trophy Carp are guarenteed to bend a pole, and ya don't even have to clean them!
Personally? I'd have less feelings about a Carp than one of my prize LMB that I throw back anyway... But? Sorry... My CC don't get such a break. Oh! Gotta run! The griddle is getting warmed up!
Too bad we don't have any european counterparts that raise carp to chime in. Or do we? Raising carp in Europe has been honed to an exact science. And I know they feed them. Maybe I can do some checking in one of my aquaculture books and get back to you.
Can you imagine getting this bruiser out of your pond? It's the new world record caught in Germany recently.
I was given 25 carp by a well meaning government hatchery guy, luckily they were all male, a couple of years ago. I didn't want them or catfish in my pond. The 25 got to be about 1 pound and I caught and gave away 20 of them in a 3 day period, I would have taken them all but they got smart. Several months later I caught 1 of the remainders, about two pounds, wow, now I am thinking I should have kept the others, what a fight, I have 7 pound tilapia that wish they were that strong. I put him back and all of the future catches will be released. They eat pellets with the best. they eat bread on a hook below a bobber and they are fun! Mine are common carp and they get big, we have much larger ones here but all carp are slow growers so I will stay with what I have for now. I will follow you progress with interest.
D.I.E.D. may be able to shed some light on California carp, I remember as a kid a big lake up in his neck of the woods was overrun with carp. Almador? Almanor? They had bow hunting contests. They should be huge by now.
Oh, I forgot to add they are really tough, low oxygen, bad water, over population, limited food they will survive. I would think that if you removed the above impediments that they would or could become world class fish, but they are ugly, did I mention that at one time they were the largest selling fish sold in restaurants in the US? and they are ugly.
Originally posted by roadtrip:
Carp fishing for sport has gotten huge down here in Texas. I am toying with the idea of turning one of my ponds into a carp fishery. Common Carp. One of my ponds already has several big carp in it , along with small bass and sunfish.
Anybody here have any ideas about managing a pond for trophy carp?
Why not Gtass Carp?
They are sterile will not get out of conrol.
They are in every way as much fun as "common" carp, if not more sport on the end of a line.
I had had 5 on last year and landed only one - it was 14.5 lbs.
They fight like a tiger.
I don't know, but I bet you could acquire small GC stockers at resonable prices?
If you decide to stock I would strongly urge you to get them from a hacthery and certified disease free. There are a couple of viruses out there that are ravaging carp and koi. One of the viruses is so serious the feds will come out and kill your fish and drain your pond if you have it!
roadtrip, you’ve got me excited about carp fishing.
I’m more into catchin’ than fishin’, and a fly fisherman to boot.
The 14.5 GC last year was caught and landed on a 9 wt striper fly rod with 16# test leader – they had been breaking me off with 5# leader on 5wt BG fly rod.
Caught on Cecil’s panty hose pellet fly.
GC in picture is so dirty because it fought me just as hard on the bank as in the water.
Boga grips won’t hold lips, so will have to have gaff in the future. :rolleyes:
I bet heavy stocked legal GC will clean out pond vegetation to such an extent that they will be so hungry they will overcome their shyness, and hit any thing thrown at them.
You’ve got me pumped up about a carp pond.
Carp will deffinately eat pellet food. GC will get large as well, we shocked one up the other day that was 35-40 lbs. Now if I could only get them to bite a hook.
roadtrip,
Funny, but I've had very similar thoughts relative to the common carp. They are possibly the strongest fish I have ever caught in fresh water and the closest thing to bonefishing in fresh water. I wouldn't be interested in the GC myself because they are primarily veg eaters, but common carp are not and thus far more catchable on flies.
I've been doing some research, inculding surveying some other ponds owners and carp fishers to determine the minimum size pond needed for such a fishery....common carp will muddy water, but if the pond is large enough and the numbers of carp small enough the water would remain clear....and that means carp fishing could be accomplished just like bonefishing in shallow salt water. I will share any info I learn and hope you do the same. I could possibly start the carp stocking as early as late this fall.
IMO the key to growing large common carp is to limit their reproduction and subsequent offspring so they don't stunt at 6-8 lbs. In southern waters this would likely mean being predator heavy with LMB and/or possibly HSB. In northern waters being pike or musky heavy would be the way to go to keep their numbers in check.
quick story, shocked a very muddy lake and it was filled with carp. We tookout about 100 3-8 lbs, did not make a dent in the 22 acre fishery. Told him to drain it. It was low for awhile b/c he is a bigtime fly fisherman. Unique situation it has a 6 mill gall a day spring running into it so basically a river slam full of carp. I pulled up one day priro to rotenone app. 2 mercedes, porshce conv, land rover and bmw, no kidding. They were friends of ownere who travel the world flyfishing and said they were having more fun than ever. ANyway killed the fish and 1,000's of carp, lake was full in 2 days. Some escpaed in the long canal leading into the lake. They are building numbers back up but we have catch and relase on bass stocked and after 4 years they are still not muddying the water yet. I have been there twice bow fishing for them. Also the upper end is one of my favorite duck spots in the state.
I guess I said all that to say yes common carp and grass carp fishing can be a blast. Especially when you hear that from folks who have been to permier world locations and make those comments.
Also I think one key to good growth is lots of aquatic vegetation.
Originally posted by george:
GC in picture is so dirty because it fought me just as hard on the bank as in the water.
Come on, george, if that GC had given you a REALLY hard time on the bank, you'd have been dirty too!
How long was that dirty girl?
Originally posted by Meadowlark:
roadtrip,
I wouldn't be interested in the GC myself because they are primarily veg eaters, but common carp are not and thus far more catchable on flies.
ML, I know you don't approve of pellet flies, but based on my experience they are very effective on GC, especialy with Cecil's version with real pellets encased in panty hose.
Your positive satements about GC and common carp catchability is misleading and your opinion only.
Common carp are becoming very popular sport fish and as you say, are now being called "freshwater bonefish", but are indeed a challenge on any type of fly.
Some of us have diferent opinions and experience levels, but are careful about stating these opinions as fact.
"IT ALL DEPENDS".
Originally posted by Theo Gallus:
Originally posted by george:
GC in picture is so dirty because it fought me just as hard on the bank as in the water.
How long was that dirty girl? 31.5 inches and 14.5 pounds...
Thanks for the replies and interests. Very helpful.
I'll keep you posted. Gotta go, late for work!
That's one big mi'ner there george!!!
roadtrip, yea, go for it! I've never found anything to fight as hard as carp. I grew up on a farm by a small town in Nebraska. On Friday nights, every bar had a carp feed and we all loved them.
I think you are starting a whole new form of small pond management that will be of interest to many of us.
I might be wrong, but I'd suspect that there is another forum, probably in Europe that could have some extremely valuable information on raising commons in small water bodies. I tried to find it (the other forum) but haven't had success so far.
...maybe try the "Guest Board" at this site.
See if somebody knows a link to carp raising in ponds.
http://carpconnection.proboards24.com/index.cgi?board=guest
This post doesn't answer your question, but I thought people might find it interesting. I live just outside of Waddington, Ny. On our village limit sign, we boast of being the "Carp Capitol of the World". We host tournaments all the time. Two years ago we hosted the World Championship, and 22 countries were represented. These people LOVE their carp! After catching and weighing one, prior to releasing it, they actually get out a first aid kit and patch up their lip! I'm not sure how many of them know that the North American Bowfishing Championship was held the following week. After weighing their catch, the fish are thrown in a big pit for a mass burial!
Going back to what Cecil said about buying from a hatchery, that is where I got mine, however, mine were intended for aquaculture and were all same sex, might be a consideration for controlling their numbers.
Originally posted by outdoorstom:
This post doesn't answer your question, but I thought people might find it interesting. I live just outside of Waddington, Ny. On our village limit sign, we boast of being the "Carp Capitol of the World". We host tournaments all the time. Two years ago we hosted the World Championship, and 22 countries were represented. These people LOVE their carp! After catching and weighing one, prior to releasing it, they actually get out a first aid kit and patch up their lip! I'm not sure how many of them know that the North American Bowfishing Championship was held the following week. After weighing their catch, the fish are thrown in a big pit for a mass burial! What a coincidence! I live about 7 miles North of Buckeye Lake, Ohio - home of the (fictional, but the T-Shirts are awesome) annual Kiss-A-Carp Pro-Am Surf Classic!
Had this little bar north of where I grew up that had a "Goose & Coon" BBQ at the end of goose/duck season. The cook also pressure-cooked a bunch of carp and made a tasty little dish(like a weird scampi)out of it.
Trying to remember if the food was really that good or if it was just the many drafts of cold beer that preceded the eatin'..........
I am going to bet....beer.
Truth be known ....... it was the beer.
Why does everybody gots to blame poor 'ole beer?
Roadtrip,
Are you interested in going on a road trip? I'm making plans to view some ponds with common carp and you would be most welcome to join in.
Here's what I've picked up thus far from some great Texas pond folks who share our interest in a common carp pond.
First, the suggestion was made to create flats areas in the pond about 18 inches deep and stair-stepped down to the next flat another 18 inches deeper and probably another one still. Very near these flats areas construct a deep narrow trench. The carp will stay in the deep trench and move onto the flats to feed....just like the bonefish do in saltwater. The stair stepping is to protect against drought and having no flat as a result and the trench is to provide the carp what they prefer naturally.
Second, it is important for the flats to have patchy vegetation...to assist in fishing for them....and this probably means that the white amur will be needed to help along those lines. Hydrilla was suggested as ideal vegetation, but that carries with it a heavy burden of control.
Third, the flats should be silty instead of gravel or straight clay. This is both what they like and the best choice for sight fishing because a gravel surface will give your presence away quickly.
Fourth, do not stock any BG or sunfish in the pond. They compete for the same food sources as the common carp. I'm thinking a LMB heavy pond with the carp, without any BG, and of course with Tilapia just might be the trick to keeping carp numbers in check and an overall balanced relatively clear pond.
Fifth, ther are many ponds in the DFW area with excellent carp fishing that remain relatively clear year-around. Interestingly, I'm told those ponds also have very good LMB fishing...but I've got to see it to believe it.
That's what I've found so far from fellow Texans who have interests in carp and a pond stocked with them....lots more research to do and a road trip to take and a trip with the top carp guide in Texas very soon. Please recognize that the 5 points above are based on "hearsay" and not from my own personal experience.....but it comes from perhaps some of the most knowledgable carp people in our State.
The prior post that suggested looking at Europe is a great idea, I believe. Also, Greg's post was most informative and I'd really be interested in hearing his thoughts or anyone's about the no sunfish approach to a LMB/carp pond.
Roadtrip, please let me know if this stuff is of interest to you...or if you are only interested in white amur...if there's no interest in this research, then I won't post it here. Thanks.
Meadowlark, sounds good to me. I'm interested in stocking both types of carp. I have 2 ponds that would work. One already has carp, common for sure, maybe some amur. I've seen 'em spawning. The other pond has no carp, but would be a good candidate for the amur. The water is clear, the bottom silty, lots of milfoil, and lots of shallow flats, lots of lmb. Also lots of sunfish, including some very big bluegill and redear. I'll pm you my contact info and we'll work on getting together on this.
My next step will be a survey on the pond with the carp to get an accurate idea of carp population and health. I've seen a few this year in the 6-8 lb. range, in past years I've seen some in the 15-20 lb. range.
I really appreciate everybody's responses to this post.